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 Post subject: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:48 pm 
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Sunshine
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Location: San Diego
So I have embarked on this major modernization campaign on my 59 Westy to make it more long distance road worthy. My goal is to have running gear that will enable me to cruise comfortably at 70 up hill and downhill. With my current set up, 1600 single port and small nut gearbox, that's not happening.
So, I built a full flowed 1800 mini stroker and switched out gearboxes with my double cab, putting the big nut in the camper.
It's been years since I drove the D.C. But there were never any issues with the gear box IRC.
I had Josh remove the gear box as the truck is at his shop and then hailed it home and went to install it this weekend. The left side bolted up fine, the right,eh, not so fine.
The fourth bolt went in but spins when going to tighten, same with the top bolt and the Middle was snapped off two thirds of the way in the hole. Only the bottom of the three will torque down.
On the Samba most people say use a Timesert, but Campomgbox said he has had good success I assume drilling the hole out and then using a half inch tap which is just a tad bigger then the stock bolt.
I assume others have had this issue? If so, curious as to how you addressed it. At this point I am tempted to get my MIG welder involved...


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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:05 pm 
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" enable me to cruise comfortably at 70 up hill and downhill "
you would leave me in the dust if I was to cruise at 70 for an extended period of time,
I don't really want to run my engine that hard, but I can keep up with the pack.
My bus cruises great at 60-65, can I go 70??, heck ( hell) yes , I can go 80!!,
I've heard from wiser than I, It's not how fast you can go, it's how fast can you stop.
I still have stock brakes, maybe the next costly upgrade will be some disc brakes.
Thenmegofast!

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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:30 am 
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Though "off the mark", ^^^thems^^^ good points. :cool:

But here's right to it: Way back in the pre-historic era when I was into them RGBs'N'sh!t, the fine thread going against the twisty torsion of the plates would make it somewhat easy for them to strip. Correct way to "fix" them is indeed to use inserts. However, again, I'm talking so far back that my "tool box" consisted pretty much of a hammer, couple of screwdrivers and a crescent wrench, oh, and a YUGE pipe wrench for that axle nut, we'd do as you suggest and tap the hole with the next bigger thread size. Now, once you do that, the hole on the plate will need to be opened up too. But if you do that and eventually you either fix it right or replace the box, then there'd be too much slop between the bolt and the hole. Can you hear that "clunk clunk" upon acceleration/breaking? :???:

As I always say: there's a hundred ways to skin a cat, though he prolly don't like any of'em. With all the options and tools available nowadays I'd go with the insert. Having been there more than I care to count, normally I just go to the FLAPS and get a kit which has not only a few different size inserts but also the tool to make it all that easy. Your choice. :cool:

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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:53 am 
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Sunshine
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pyrOman wrote:
Though "off the mark", ^^^thems^^^ good points. :cool:

But here's right to it: Way back in the pre-historic era when I was into them RGBs'N'sh!t, the fine thread going against the twisty torsion of the plates would make it somewhat easy for them to strip. Correct way to "fix" them is indeed to use inserts. However, again, I'm talking so far back that my "tool box" consisted pretty much of a hammer, couple of screwdrivers and a crescent wrench, oh, and a YUGE pipe wrench for that axle nut, we'd do as you suggest and tap the hole with the next bigger thread size. Now, once you do that, the hole on the plate will need to be opened up too. But if you do that and eventually you either fix it right or replace the box, then there'd be too much slop between the bolt and the hole. Can you hear that "clunk clunk" upon acceleration/breaking? :???:

As I always say: there's a hundred ways to skin a cat, though he prolly don't like any of'em. With all the options and tools available nowadays I'd go with the insert. Having been there more than I care to count, normally I just go to the FLAPS and get a kit which has not only a few different size inserts but also the tool to make it all that easy. Your choice. :cool:


When you say insets are you ruling timeserts or helicoil?


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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:17 am 
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Everyone on this forum is a far better and more capable mechanic than I am. Being in our 60s we realize that we only so much time and energy to put into "anything". Over the years we have done quick and dirty jobs generally due to finances and/or time.
We have now taken a pledge to ourselves to do things once and forever.
In this case it seems like drilling the housing would qualify as a "quick and dirty". So I would use the insert. (In my case have some qualified individual do the insert for me.) What others have said is that the Timesert is far superior to a Helicoil.

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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:21 am 
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And cruise uphill or down at 70? I have only briefly had our bus at 70 and I was very uncomfortable doing that. Good for you if you can do that.

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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:38 am 
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Sunshine wrote:
pyrOman wrote:
Though "off the mark", ^^^thems^^^ good points. :cool:

But here's right to it: Way back in the pre-historic era when I was into them RGBs'N'sh!t, the fine thread going against the twisty torsion of the plates would make it somewhat easy for them to strip. Correct way to "fix" them is indeed to use inserts. However, again, I'm talking so far back that my "tool box" consisted pretty much of a hammer, couple of screwdrivers and a crescent wrench, oh, and a YUGE pipe wrench for that axle nut, we'd do as you suggest and tap the hole with the next bigger thread size. Now, once you do that, the hole on the plate will need to be opened up too. But if you do that and eventually you either fix it right or replace the box, then there'd be too much slop between the bolt and the hole. Can you hear that "clunk clunk" upon acceleration/breaking? :???:

As I always say: there's a hundred ways to skin a cat, though he prolly don't like any of'em. With all the options and tools available nowadays I'd go with the insert. Having been there more than I care to count, normally I just go to the FLAPS and get a kit which has not only a few different size inserts but also the tool to make it all that easy. Your choice. :cool:


When you say insets are you ruling timeserts or helicoil?


I take it that timeserts are "socket" like vs helicoils being just a coil wire inside a thread? If so I think either would be okay since the idea is to "fix" the threaded hole in order to use the correct diameter bolt. :-s

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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 7:48 am 
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I believe if you do your research, Google, you'll see that the time-cert is the better, more permanent fix. It (the kit) also cost about three time more then the same size helicoil kit.

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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 7:52 am 
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I had the same issue once. I put a bolt that was 1/2 longer in and it worked? Just my .02!

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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:00 am 
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Here is the video of the procedure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9W ... e=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uP2Up_hG7rc

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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 1:14 pm 
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Sunshine
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I think I will start out conservatively and buy a 12x1.5 metric tap and hope I can clean up the threads and use a slightly longer bolt and see if it will torque down.
If that fails, then I will buy a 1/2 inch tap, drill it to use and tap it for .5 bolts. Campignbox seems to think you don the need to expand the spring plate holes.
Last resort is welding the boxes on...I mean using timeserts.


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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:42 pm 
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Sunshine
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Bought the tap at Carquest ran it through and using a longer bolt I got more tightness but it barely feels like its hanging in there, like it's the bottom couple threads actually gripping. I can ram the bolt in a few millimeters and then it is like a lose tooth rattling around until it gets deeper in. Not good for such an essential job, so next step I will buy a half inch tap and then get the right bolts.


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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:28 am 
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Sunshine
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The 1/2 inch tap didn't work, wouldn't hold 80lbs of torque, so I broke down and spent $90 on the Timesert kit for stock sized bolts.
Unfortunately, the drill bit and router don't fit a standard drill, so I had to machine the stock to fit. Other than that the kit was easy to use, drill out the hole a bit, tap, route out the end for the insert, install inset with tool as your done. I did two holes ans both held 80lbs torque.
Now to see if the trans is actually good...


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 Post subject: Re: Stripped RGB holes
Unread postPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:48 am 
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Good job Dan!!

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65 Sundial Camper
68 Single Cab
61 Rag Top
03 Passat
SV2s Member #231


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